or more than a decade, producer Rick McCallum has worked tirelessly on the Star Wars saga. Although his first efforts resulted in the special-edition versions of the original Star Wars films, McCallum is best known as writer/director George Lucas' right hand and collaborator throughout the production of Episodes I, II and III.
Science Fiction Weekly recently had a chance to catch up with McCallum, who offered his reflections on Episode III and how the DVD complements the film. No topic was off limits: McCallum also gives us the scoop on tentative plans for the new Star Wars live-action and animated series and talks about the future of high-def DVD and 3-D filmmaking, too.
In many ways, Episode III really brought the saga full circle. How much of that was in your collective minds as you were heading into production on this, even considering the composition of specific shots?
McCallum: There's no question we knew way back in 1990 that Episode I and II were going to be very tough, especially with anyone over probably 18 years old or anyone who had had any relationship with the original trilogy. So Episode III was the one that we knew would hopefully bring peace to the galaxy between both fan groups. But we also knew that [Episode III] was the film that everybody who was older wanted Episode I to be. We never knew if it was going to be enough to try and tie everything together, or if it was going to be too quick, it wasn't going to go deep enough, or that things were going to be missing ... but we knew that, in some kind of collective déjà vu sentiment, [Episode III] would definitely have enormous impact with all of our hard-core fans—both young and old. I think we finally delivered some peace and safety to everybody.
Certain shots echoed back to the original trilogy, in a way that strengthens the original trilogy as well as the earlier films in the contemporary trilogy.
McCallum: Absolutely. Well, [those shots] were planned. George and I watched all six films back to back when we finished, right after the film, just before Episode III opened, and [this one] really does affect the way you look at the first ones. Look at it as the saga of a family, and the impact that it has once you start at Episode IV, because you're coming to it with a whole new set of information—you know what's happened [before it]. That's why we're so excited about the TV series, because that 18-year period between Episode III and IV—when Luke and Leia are growing up—there are just so many issues, personalities, characters that we can really get into in a much more character-based way, instead of in a plot-based environment like film. Television just gives you the opportunity to really explore issues; I'm really looking forward to that.
Is the series going to at all follow the Skywalkers' saga?
McCallum: No, it's not. Well, anything can happen, because we haven't really sat down and considered everything. We know it's going to be darker, much edgier, and with a totally different kind of sense of humor, a different look altogether, so it'll be much more dramatic [than the films]. But there's no plan to follow Luke and Leia as they're kids growing up. There will probably be some kind of reference to them, you know, to keep it all in the same feel of what's going on, but so far it'll be basically with characters that you're not that familiar with, and we'll be exploring everything that's going on during that 18-year period.
What is the timeline for the series?
McCallum: We wouldn't even start shooting it until 2007. George is finishing up the script for Indiana Jones IV, and then we'll start on the TV series.
And you're working on the planned animated Star Wars series before the live-action series?
McCallum: I'm not, but it is being done here at the Ranch, and I'm very excited about the guys that are working on it. I think the first real episode will start being made in end of March, late April [2006].
Back to Episode III for a moment: In light of the sequence of cutscenes featured on the DVD, can you comment on the decision to focus the story squarely on Anakin's journey, as opposed to having multiple storylines, as you've had in the previous episodes?
McCallum: Well, I think at the end of the day there was no other place to [do it]: We had to make Anakin's transformation. Again, this is the thing that we knew everybody was really interested in. How did this happen—and not only how it happened, but, you know, what were the things that motivated him to make the change, and how was the transformation going to take place? And once you know that, then you just [go] for it, and that was the only thing that the film [ultimately] was about, Anakin's transformation and then, of course, tying up everything so it all made sense leading into the original trilogy. So I think way back even in 1991, '92, when George started outlining the whole story of Episodes I, II and III, it was pretty well locked in. He had done the backstory 25 years ago; this was the one where Anakin turns.
The cutscenes—particularly those circling back to the Rebel Alliance—really added an extra, otherwise missing dimension to the film.
McCallum: I know, and it's such a hard one. We've been criticized so many times in the past for not making it clear and showing the first meeting of the Rebel Alliance and all of that, but there's just certain stuff, when we cut the film together, it just didn't work, or it held things up. And you're never really sure [it's the right move to cut it] because you're under such pressure; we only finished the film a couple of weeks before it opened, and we only finished the effects a couple weeks before that, so we never even actually got to see the film until we were ready to lay it down. And then there's not enough time to think about it and try different cuts, and you've just got to move on. It's so relentless. So that's one of the reasons why we put them into the DVD. I mean, usually when a deleted scene is deleted it's because it just doesn't work, but we always love everybody to at least have the opportunity to show everything that we've actually physically shot [to the fans].
On the DVD, you cited the sequence with Yoda arriving on Dagobah as your favorite. That was a gorgeous shot.
McCallum: I know. I loved it. One day, you know, I'm hoping George will put it back in.
Hey, we still have the future version, either on Blu-ray Disc or whatever high-definition format will succeed DVD.
McCallum: Exactly. That's what I'm looking [forward] to. It's just around the corner. We've shot over 800 or 900 hours just on Episode III, almost 3,000 hours across all three of the films. There's just so much stuff we could put into the next disc. We could do a veritable film school, you know, of all the 22 craft grades of what it takes to make a movie, something we just don't physically have the space to do today. To see [the future high-def format] so close, just around the corner ... one day I'm hoping we can go back in and edit all that footage we have. We're trying to get that together, but that'll be a couple years in the future.
You've already made a good start on the film school concept with Episode III's "Within a Minute" documentary. That piece really provides insight into the entire filmmaking process, from nuts to bolts.
McCallum: When George and I were seeing Episode II a couple years ago and we were in a small—well, not a small, but probably a 700-seat theater—and at the end of the movie, like, 200 people left, but then there were another 450, 500 people that stayed for 8 minutes, watching 2,000 names go in front of them. This was really fascinating to me, because it was such a disproportionate number of people who waited right until the very end. I remember there was a little kid in front of us when we were walking out, and he was asking his dad what a rigger and a best-boy grip was. So I always thought it would be a very interesting thing [to do something that showed] who those people are, for those of you who actually do stay at the end [of a movie]. We originally planned on doing a five-minute film, but it ended up being eight hours long, so we had to cut it down. Once Blu-ray gets here, then we'll have a real shot at being able to go as deep as you possibly can [behind the scenes].
"Within a Minute" really makes it possible to appreciate the work that went into the long-anticipated Mustafar duel between Obi-Wan and Anakin. How did the reality of that sequence, perhaps the ultimate battle in this saga, differ from what you envisioned it would be?
McCallum: Well, it only differed in that I wanted it to be a little bit more of the unbelievable betrayal of two best friends. It was very hard to get the balance of that. And because it was a big set, I also knew it was going to be complicated technologically, because we had to animate the lava. Although we did get a lucky break when Italy's Mount Etna blew up, and we were able to go and film that; Mount Etna gave us incredible reference and a lot of background material to be able to place in [the film]. I always knew technologically it was going to be a big, tough scene, but, you know, it was pretty easy [in the end]. We only had a couple days to shoot it, but everybody was pretty much in sync. We did it right at the very end of the movie, so it was fun. There wasn't anything mysterious to it; it was just a complicated scene that provided the perfect minute to take and say, "How do so many people work on one little thing?" Because that scene was really almost 100,000 [hours] of work.
I noticed that the Episode III DVD features very effective two-channel surround sound.
McCallum: Yes. I really believe it sets a [new standard]. All of us, including Jim Cameron and Peter Jackson, are trying to set a new benchmark in terms of the imagery and the sound; it's getting to the point where there isn't a single theater in this country that can show a movie like you can see it in a normal television set in your home. And that's a good and a bad thing. It's great because it allows people who really care and love and want to worship [film] to keep and cherish their movies, and to really have something they can experience at home that more closely resembles what a filmmaker has made. But it also is a challenge to the rest of the industry, that they better get their s--t together and figure out a way to change the nature of what the experience of seeing a movie is. Because if we don't, we're just going to lose it altogether, because we're losing [our audience]—I think this year saw like a 15 percent drop in theater attendance. There's a whole transformation of how people are seeing their movies. The adventure of going to the movies isn't the same as it used to be. It's going to be a challenge.
Is the challenge of regaining theater-going audiences part of the reasoning why you're planning to take Episode IV—A New Hope and the other installments in the trilogies into 3-D?
McCallum: Absolutely. Well, I mean, it's done because of two things. How do you tap into the greed of the average theater owner? You know, and make him understand that unless he provides some other other way of looking at cinema, they are virtually going to lose their audience. There are 100,000 film clubs in universities now. Netflix is growing at a rate that is unlike anything we've ever seen. Most people are just not going to the movies. Once you've become a kind of economic slave—you're 28 years old and your car breaks down or you want to get a mortgage, you're in a job, you get married and all the normal things of what it's like to live, or become a slave to, the American dream—suddenly it becomes much harder to go to the movies. It also gets much more expensive, and just even with the gas prices. The average kid now at college has got an extra $30 to $50 a month in gas bills, and they're wiling not to go see a movie. They'll see it on DVD, but they're smart enough to know if there's a movie that they're on the edge about all they have do is wait 10 weeks and they can buy it at Costco or Wal-Mart for cheaper than what it is to pay and park and get popcorn and everything else.
Transforming the business is the first thing. What about the 3-D process itself?
McCallum: The 3-D, it's a wonderful post-production process. It's done by a company called N3. We've been working with them for about 4 years. We gave them about 10 minutes' worth of Episode IV a couple of years ago, and they came back with this completely immersive 3-D technology where they take any 2-D film and turn it into a 3-D image that you can be the architect of, because you can go in and change virtually every effect that you put into a frame and move it closer or pull it back, and even change the perspective of it. The wireless technology for the glasses allows you to see this [immersive experience] from any seat in the theater, without getting any eyestrain.
We're hoping 3-D is going to kick-start the digital revolution, because it can only be done on a digital projector. Hopefully the theater owners will just see it as another revenue stream. 3-D isn't right for every film, but it definitely expands and changes the dynamic of what it's like to go to a movie.
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George R.R. Martin
