he fourth film adaptation of J.K. Rowling's immensely popular novel series sees trainee wizard Harry Potter (Daniel Radcliffe) battle with dragons and demented Dark Lords and, most daring of all—attempt to date the girl of his dreams. Best friend Ron Weasley (Rupert Grint) has to contend with jealousy, betrayal and a near-terminal dose of teenage attitude, while Hermione Grainger (Emma Watson) transforms from a bookish goody two-shoes to a beautiful young woman. That all three emerge older, wiser and definitely triumphant is down to the magic of director Mike Newell and producer David Heyman.
Newell is the first British director to put his stamp on the Harry Potter franchise. Best known in the U.K. for delights such as Four Weddings and a Funeral, Newell has also worked with some of North America's finest, including Johnny Depp, Al Pacino, Kate Hudson and Ben Affleck.
Producer David Heyman spent many years in the U.S. as a "creative" with Warner Brothers before returning to the U.K. to set up Heyday Films with the intention of forging a unique relationship between Europe and the U.S. to produce great international movies.
Science Fiction Weekly caught up with this group of talented people in London a few days before the movie's world premiere in Leicester Square.
Mike Newell, you're the newcomer to the Harry Potter world. What was it like to join such a successful franchise?
Newell: It's very daunting, to start with. The book is as big as a house brick, and I was very unsure quite how one would attack it. But, of course, you come after these wonderful guys ... you come after Chris Columbus and you come after Alfonzo Cuaron, and you are guided through this minefield by David Heyman, and little by little you lose your terror of it. But after a bit, the thing itself overwhelms you, and what you do is try and get from day to day. At the end of it all, looking back, I'm terribly proud of it.
There's a story that you were angry about the lack of cash. What are your feelings on that?
Newell: I'm sorry, but that is a vast piece of quoting out of context. Let me tell you what I actually said. What I said was that when I began, the sheer scale of the film is daunting, and then after a little bit, like every film that I've ever made, big or small—and I'm sure this applies to all other directors—you feel that there isn't quite enough money to put the absolute little topspin on it. Of course, you start to feel aggrieved that there is not enough money, and it answers the question "How long did you stay frightened?" And the answer to the question is not very long.
What was the final figure?
Newell: I can't tell you that, and I'm not going to.
Ballpark figure?
Newell: Nope. Sorry.
Clearly there are lots cut from the book, but it doesn't feel as if there are bits missing from the film. How do you find that balance?
Newell: David was very clear to me when we first started to talk about me making the film, that if I could see a way of making one film then we could continue to talk. If not, we should part friends. There was a time when people were thinking about making two films. But I read the book very carefully and I felt two things. I felt there was a way of making one film, which means that there was a way of shedding the things that needed to be shed, because the book is too big to make as a single film. And that it was a thriller. It was that, in fact, Voldemort [Ralph Fiennes] was really in charge of events right from the very beginning, and only little by little did Harry catch up with what was happening to him, until it was too late. There he was facing the devil in a graveyard. As soon as I could see that, I felt that I could stay true to the book and at the same time keep the length down.
There's a line at the end of the movie when Hermione says, "Everything's going to change." What's been the biggest dramatic difference in this one?
Newell: For me, it's that I think in the previous films, the age of the people is crucial. What's been happening is that the scale of the challenge to the leading character has been limited. He's had a basilisk to deal with. He's had this problem, that problem, but he's never actually been challenged in his self. He's never had to put up or shut up. He's always had the group to rely on. Now, in this one, he's older, he's more conscious, so he knows much more what's happening to him. And he knows when Voldemort says in that graveyard, "Come out here! What do you want? To take it in the back or take it in the front, but you're gonna get it whatever way." That this is it! But what Harry says is, "All right, I'll show you." And he comes out and he's ready for a fight, and he knows that it's a fight to the death, and he has the moral courage to do it. Of course, there are lots and lots of differences. There are lots of wonderful new things about this, like the jokes and growing up and girls, and "Oh God, how do we dance?", and all of those things. But the big difference is the challenge is kind of a moral one, and he may not survive it.
Heyman: When we went to Jo Rowling the first time, this was a very important thing for her. A theme that will be continued, which is to stand up and be counted. Even if you might not win, you have to stand up for what you believe in. The other thing is the kids, frankly, are growing as actors, and Mike is benefiting from them having had two films with Chris and one film with Alfonso. At the same time I think the real reason, and one of the many reasons that we brought Mike in, is that he is one of the great directors of actors, and the kids are challenged. He didn't let them rest one minute on what felt comfortable. He pushed and pushed and pushed, and the performances show it.
This film is much darker than previous ones, and certainly there are some scenes that made us jump out of our seats. Are you happy the movie has been given a PG-13 in the U.S.?
Heyman: Very much so, and I am very happy with the 12A in the U.K. One, I think that it'll be good for the slightly older audience, and two, I think that we had to be ... we chose to be faithful to the material. The books do not talk down to an audience, the audience reaches for the books, and I think the films do the same; they don't patronize our audience. We make films very much in the spirit—it's not literally faithful, it is truly faithful to the spirit of what Jo has written, and that's really exciting.
Newell: One of the challenges was that, of course, everything goes back to the book, always. That's where the audience begins as well. And so as the audience, which began with the first book, progresses through 2 and 3 they get to 4, and they see that it's a different kind of animal. It's a much tougher beast than the others, and if you don't get a PG-13, in a way, then that audience that began with number 1 and is now 14, 15, 16 or 64, whatever, will kind of want to know why you are still infantilizing the situation. Of course, what David says is that these are not children's books. These are kind of adult stories, with a very strong moral aim and view, so with PG-13 they [the audience] can believe. Without it I am not sure they can.
Watson: I think to some extent our audience who were fans of Harry Potter are growing up with the films. Yes, to some extent we might have lost some of the much younger audience because, well, I'm in it and I got scared. But at the same time I think that we've all gained by it. This one is more of a thriller, which I really like, and it's always been about staying faithful to the book. It's always been about staying faithful to the book, and you can't avoid the fact that someone dies in it at the end of the day. There are some very serious and deep topics in it. You can't avoid it, and I love the fact that they haven't pulled the punches and have gone with it and have made something which is true to the book and have made a really, really good film. It was the way to go.
Heyman: The ratings don't exclude under 13s, it just means that they have to be accompanied by an adult. We did a couple of test screenings, and at test screenings you have people fill out cards and give their views. A lot of them said their favorite character was Voldemort, and sometimes he was the character they liked least. We did two groups of 30, and the people who were more concerned about it being scary were the adults rather than the kids themselves. We had a couple of parents out of the 60 who did speak up, and the kids who were with them were shocked and really upset by it. They said, "Mum! That's embarrassing." I think kids are more up for this than the parents. It's not that it's not scary. It is.
Watson: ... And I was talking about a much, much younger audience. I mean, really young kids, like 5-year-olds.
Heyman: Emma is right, I think for 5 years or 6 years old. Or 4- or 5-year-olds I would think twice. It's difficult, because it really depends on where you live and how you've been brought up, what you're exposed to. You might find some 4-year-olds who've grown up with LOTR and Exorcist.
Much has been made of the very British sensibilities Mike has brought to the movie. What are your thoughts on that?
Heyman: Mike brings an innate sense of understanding of British school life. The school is more anarchic than I feel it's been in any of the other films. It's a little madder and a little looser. Yes, you have the authority of the teachers, but you also have the kids rebelling as kids do; kids standing up for themselves; kids complaining to teachers, and I think Mike brings a real sense of that. I think it's very true to a lot of schools, definitely the school that I went to, and I think it's true to school life in general, but it's most certainly true to British schools. I also think that, in a way, the nature of the performances ... it's an incredible thing I don't know quite how to describe ... but I really feel that the performances in this are more British than they have ever been. I feel that there is a complexity and, you know, at times a Bollywood theatrical largeness, in a really positive way, to the performances. By the way, I think Dan [Radcliffe] is incredibly subtle and nuanced, and I think there is a boldness about all the performances which I think is very, very British, and I'm very happy for that.
Newell: There was maybe a problem in that these guys [the kids] would think of me as a teacher or an authority figure, and I didn't much like the thought of that. I felt that they had grown up to the point where they've got a lot to give, and one of the wonderful things about them is that they all want to be better. All of them. Which is terrific. But if they take you as an authority figure they're obedient but they aren't giving properly, and so there was this day in which I found myself having a fight with one of the Weasley twins [Oliver and Jamie Phelps] in order that I would lose my dignity. I didn't think they would think of me as any sort of authority figure if I was a fat, middle-aged man rolling in the dust with a 17-year-old boy.
Radcliffe: And he fractured ... He broke a rib.
Newell: Oh, and I did break a rib.
Heyman: So he really was middle-aged.
Watson: One of the great things about Mike is he really treated us like adults and gave us the responsibility, and sometimes that was difficult, because sometimes I would say to him, "Just tell me how to do. Please tell me what to do. I can't get this right. Tell me how to do it." And he would say, "I can't tell you how to do it, and I won't tell you what to do. This has got to come from you." I think he directed us but didn't tell us what to do, and I've learned a lot.
Grint: Compared to when I did the first one, it was a whole new sort of experience. I'd never sort of done anything like it before, and it was all sort of scary. But I think we've all learned a lot since then, and it's quite strange having a new director each time, 'cause you don't really know what to expect. But Mike was great. He was a really good laugh, and we had a great time.
Radcliffe: We've grown up enough to feel confident enough to make our own acting decisions. But we do it in collaboration with Mike. We don't just go out and do whatever we want when we want to do it. That's what Mike is great at, is directing that energy.
Given that your characters are so well known all over the world, how much impact does it have on your life away from Harry Potter?
Radcliffe: First, with regard to the power thing—I think Emma is right in terms of we don't think of it as power, although I do insist on a huge chariot to take me to work every morning, and a throne to carry me around in (laughs). Emma answered the first question beautifully, so I'll go on to answer the question about us not living a normal life. Some people find it quite hard to believe that we can live normal lives, and I can sort of see why people refuse to believe that we are telling the truth and think we are just liars, but we are actually able to just go out. It's often sensible to wear a hat. Not one that draws attention, so not a cowboy hat or something. Just a baseball cap or something pulled down. But, other than that, we still go out to the cinema. I mean, it actually hasn't changed. For me I only feel famous for about two days a year which are the Premieres. Other than that, it doesn't intrude into our lives so much. Having said that, there is a possibility that may change when we're 18, because maybe the paparazzi and photographers have been going quite easy on us, and that might change. But I hope it continues.
Heyman: Just in general, we try to maintain a pretty normal atmosphere at Leavesden [Studios]. There are a lot of the same faces around, and the kids are a lot more confident than when we began, but they are still the same people. They are still open and generous individuals. Power? I think the power that they have, as Emma said, is about responsibility more than anything.
Watson: And it's not something that is just put on our shoulders; it is something we want to take on.
Now that the Goblet of Fire is completed and receiving rave reviews, what can you tell us about the fifth film?
Radcliffe: Nothing—other than we're all signed up for it and really excited, looking forward to it.
Heyman: I can tell you that Michael Goldenberg is writing the fifth—The Order of the Phoenix. He's a great writer and doing a fantastic job. We start filming in February. We asked Mike if he'd like to direct and he said no. These films are a real endurance test, and I don't know how Chris Columbus had the stamina to do two back to back. At the end of each film, we ask the director if they would like to do the next one. We asked Chris Columbus if he would like to do the third and he said no, and we asked Alfonso if he would like to do the fourth and he said no. We asked Mike if he would like to do the fifth and he said no. We've hired a chap called David Yates who is a brilliant director. He's won lots of BAFTAs for his British television work. He's done something called "State of Play" and it's fantastic. We've been really lucky; each director is the right director for the films they've done. In terms of casting, we are searching everywhere for the right Luna Lovegood. We're down to the final four or five girls for that. Imelda Staunton you've heard about for the role of Umbridge, and we already have in mind a Tonks and a Shacklebolt, but I am reluctant to mention them as we haven't made their deal.
And the rumours about Liz Hurley?
Heyman:
You press really invent a lot. That is not true.
Just before we leave we'd like to ask the "trio" what their favorite memories of this year have been?
Radcliffe: My favorite memory is not to do with the film. My favorite memory is that I went to the Reading Festival this year for the first time. It's a music festival, and it was amazing. It was one of the best three days of my life, and it was one of those times when you were exhausted, because it's three days without proper sleep, but it doesn't matter because it's just so cool to be there. So that is my best memory of 2005.
Watson: Probably switching on the lights in Oxford Street is my most magical amazing moment. I will remember that for the rest of my life, probably.
Grint: I find it quite hard to remember the last year, really. Recently I saw the film for the first time, and that was definitely a good feeling. So that's about it, really.
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Also in this issue:
Poppy Z. Brite, Andrew Fox and Albert E. Cowdrey
